What Happens in Our Final Moments: The Energy of Letting Go

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey everyone, on this week's episode of Whispers from the Mist, Conversations from the Spiritual Byway, we share a story that lives in the space between fear and peace, between loss and something far more mysterious. When my grandfather passed away, one of my family members experienced a moment so profound it forever changed her understanding of death. So, we're joined by a very special guest, my younger sister Christine, and we're going to explore what it means to witness love at the edge of life and how the unseen may be closer than we think. Hello, everyone, and welcome to this week's episode of Whispers from the Mist. Daisy, do you remember the rest of it this week?

SPEAKER_03 0:55

I like to cut you off. Conversations from the spiritual byway. There we go.

SPEAKER_01 1:02

You got it right. How are you today?

SPEAKER_03 1:04

I'm doing well. How are you?

SPEAKER_01 1:05

I'm doing fine. My uh workspace here is a little bit cluttered and it's driving me nuts, but it's for a good reason. I love it, and I'm actually kind of excited. I'm really excited too because we've been talking about this for a while. So I just want to take a minute, Stacy, to introduce the guests that we're gonna be having.

SPEAKER_03 1:25

Let's do it. You know her better than me.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Yes, I've known her for my entire life. She is 23 months younger than me. She is my sister. And growing up, it's been a lot of fun. She's a really fun person to be around here laughing in the background. But we're a little bit different. I'm more quiet. She's more outgoing, more expressive. But along the way, she became a little bit more apprehensive or sensitive to the fear of the unknown. She's a wife, she's a mom, she has two grown boys, she loves life, she loves adventure, she loves being outdoors. And many years ago, she also had a very profound experience when our grandpa, who we call Gramps, passed away. His passing completely changed how she views death and what may happen after we leave the physical world. And even though he was a grandfather to both of us, we experience his passing in very different ways. So we're going to talk about that today. And we're just going to have an open and heartfelt conversation about the experience and what it meant to each of us and maybe how it's changed both of us. So this is my sister Christine.

unknown 2:35

Hi.

SPEAKER_01 2:35

Hi, Christine. How are you?

SPEAKER_02 2:37

I'm good. How are you?

SPEAKER_01 2:38

You're hogging my space, but I'm good.

SPEAKER_02 2:41

I'm always in your space. I know.

SPEAKER_01 2:43

Especially when it comes to stuff like this. I know. I've kind of always taken the lead, taken her hand, and tried to nudge her towards it where she does have a natural curiosity about it. She's a little bit more apprehensive.

SPEAKER_03 2:56

I can understand that. I think it's it's very normal to be not just apprehensive, but to question your own sanity sometimes when we're talking about anything spiritually related.

SPEAKER_01 3:05

I know. I'm trying to get her to go to the Warren House in at the end of August or the middle of August. And she's a little hesitant, but I think I'm gonna get her there.

SPEAKER_02 3:15

Well, she just took me to the Idaho State Penitentiary. Oh. Like a it was just kind of a walk. What was it? Just a tour. Yeah, just a tour. And that night I was like, we both had our own beds, but I was in her bed and my head was like buried in her back. I'm like, I just it was just uneasy there. Like lots of energy, lots of yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:38

And and when you feel that, when you step into a space where you start to feel the different energy, it can be very um disarming because you don't know what to do with it or or how to I don't want to say protect yourself against it because I I know if you were with Michelle, she was, I guarantee, protecting you anyways, but it's still different to sit in that kind of energy. It's a very weird energy for sure.

SPEAKER_01 4:02

And the funny part is I had an earlier flight to catch than she did, and so when I left it was dark outside still, and she couldn't handle it. She had to go to the airport like three hours early just to get away from the darkness and being by herself. It scared me.

SPEAKER_02 4:17

I didn't like, I mean, it was just uneasy. It was just an energy. Like when we talk about my grandpa passing, it was just a different energy there. Yeah. Like that was kind of a a positive energy, and this was very negative and very unsettling and heavy.

SPEAKER_03 4:34

And you you almost in when you're sitting in a space where it's that heavier energy, you almost feel unsafe. Not like you're somebody's gonna like hurt you physically, but like you keep waiting for something to jump out or show up or just be there. Yes. Yeah. Correct. That leaves you very on edge.

SPEAKER_02 4:52

She was getting ready to go. I said, Oh yeah, yeah, I'm going to. She's like, You don't have to go to the airport for three hours. I'm going.

SPEAKER_03 4:58

You're not letting me here by myself.

SPEAKER_01 5:01

Well, my sister, um, like me, always did kind of have a fear of dying. And we're gonna be telling the story of our grandpa passing. And for very different reasons, I was always fearful because what if something happened to my parents? What would that do to us? And then the fear for myself started to take shape. Whereas you had an experience, didn't you, that kind of made you fearful of dying at a young age?

SPEAKER_02 5:31

Oh, yeah. I had I was in, I think I was in seventh grade and a kid had a a seizure and it was very, very, very terrifying. And I just, yeah, I thought it was gonna happen to me. It was contagious, or it was gonna happen to me, and I was gonna be alone, and I was very scared about that. It show those because I was in her room every night.

SPEAKER_01 5:54

Yes. Again, I had a bed partner every night growing up because she didn't want to stay alone.

SPEAKER_03 6:00

I I completely get that. My little sister actually had seizures when I was growing up, and they can be very, very scary to witness. Yes, if you don't like, I've never witnessed anything like that.

SPEAKER_02 6:11

And poor guy. It was just it was scary. It was scary how it was handled. It was scary what happened.

SPEAKER_01 6:16

Yeah. If we can now we'll just transition into the story that we're going to be sharing, which is the loss of Gramps. And he died mainly from old age. He lived a very beautiful life. It was filled with adventure. He was quite the character, very funny, taught us a lot of lessons about life. I cannot tell you how many times prior to him passing, he actually was rushed to the hospital. And we were told, you need to go see your grandpa because this is it. And he always rebounded.

SPEAKER_02 6:52

So we called him the comeback man.

SPEAKER_01 6:55

Yeah, the comeback king because he always rebounded. I mean, he was at death's door. Like, you need to go have your last visit with him. And he would come back. But for this particular event, obviously he didn't. I do think he chose the date that he passed because it was actually on his birthday. So he was born and died on the same day. He wanted all 87 years. He didn't want to be shorted a day. Yeah, not a single day. Too much to put into it. I was actually out of town, and then this experience unfolded for my sister. And I think this is going to open up some great conversation about when somebody passes, do they get to choose who's with them? So I'm gonna let you share your story.

SPEAKER_02 7:40

I'm just like, where do I start?

SPEAKER_01 7:43

The night he passed, he was in Alaska. It was a cold night.

SPEAKER_02 7:46

Correct her if she's wrong.

SPEAKER_01 7:48

He was in an assisted living home. And because it was his birthday, my mom, my sister, and my dad went to the location with a cake, I believe, yeah, to celebrate.

SPEAKER_02 7:59

Even though he couldn't eat cake, we still wanted some of the people there could, and we still wanted to celebrate his birthday. It's a sense of normalcy, right? Like even Yeah, and he was in he was in a coma for like the last three days, two days.

SPEAKER_01 8:14

I didn't know that. Till this moment. I did not know that I was out of town.

SPEAKER_02 8:18

Yeah, he was just not he couldn't respond.

SPEAKER_01 8:20

He just Okay. So they were at the building. My brother, who had been to that assisted living home many times, was on his way to see him, and that day took a wrong turn. So my grandpa's laying there, he's in his bed, my dad steps out of the room, and then this event unfolds. My mom is standing up near my grandpa's head, and my sister's standing near his feet. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:50

My mom was kind of like rubbing his throat because he's making a really scary sound. And his friend Hope was just kind of rubbing his arm, his hand, and I was at his feet, and I was kind of rubbing the top of his feet. And it prior to this, I I was always praying to God that he would give him comfort and he would give him peace and let him not because my grandfather was afraid to die. He was very, very, very afraid to die. And so I was just prayed for all that. And then that day when we were there, I was just kind of rubbing the top of his foot, and I just kind of was kind of looking above him, and I was just praying, and then all this positive energy, like I knew God was there, I knew his loved ones were there. I just, it was surrounded by so much good positive energy, and I couldn't look away. Like I kept trying to kind of move my eyes and look at him or look at my mom, and I just I couldn't look away. And then I just I saw him go. I saw him leave. And I said to my mom, I said, he just died. And she's like, No, he didn't, sis. He's right here. And I'm like, no, he's not. And then at that point, his head just kind of turned over. And but it's it's the weirdest experience. And I know this is gonna sound weird, but my grandfather dying was just as beautiful as like a baby coming into this world. Like it was peaceful. It was it was I mean, it was just amazing. And at that point, and I'm not afraid to die. Like that is not that is not a fear that I have. Like I don't want to go early, but I'm not afraid to die. Did that shift happen like that, like while you were in the room? Oh yeah. Like I went, I went to, I just went home and I just felt I felt comfort. I knew that he made it. I knew he was in heaven, I knew he was with God. I knew You just knew. It was just, yeah, it was just, it was super comforting. And it was like the best energy that I've ever felt in my life.

SPEAKER_03 11:01

It's it's such a beautiful story, and I think it offers this level of I I'm gonna say normalcy about death too, because it is, it's supposed to be as beautiful as as like birth. It really isn't supposed to be this feared thing in our lives. It's it's a part of who we are.

SPEAKER_02 11:22

Yeah. I don't, you know, sometimes I don't think people really are necessarily afraid to die. I think they're afraid of the pain or just kind of leaving their loved ones. And I don't know, but it was it was amazing. I it was beautiful.

SPEAKER_03 11:38

I think I absolutely agree with what you just said. I think a lot of it is the the fear of loss and the fear of not being with loved ones. I think that's actually why people end up staying after they I think I think so too, or just just holding on, not being able to let go.

SPEAKER_01 11:53

Because what does happen next? I mean, nobody knows for sure. We all have feelings about it or theories about it.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

I don't know. Like when I saw him go, like, I know what's happening. I know where I'm going, I know what's gonna be there, I know what's waiting.

SPEAKER_01 12:09

Did you feel like he had other loved ones in the room that weren't alive right now?

SPEAKER_02 12:14

Oh, I've like the energy that was there and the car I mean, it was it was so powerful, but like I knew God was there, I knew grandma was there, I knew his family, his brothers, sisters, mom, like he was just surrounded by so much good energy.

SPEAKER_03 12:29

I love that.

SPEAKER_01 12:31

And I think it's beautiful, and we'll go back to what I said prior to her sharing the experience with Gramps, is I think when somebody passes, they choose who's in the room with them. I mean, my sister had this connection with my grandpa where she knew he was afraid to die. And while I guess I knew it, I wasn't sitting with it like her. And she got to be there and experienced that. So he chose you to be there so you could experience and face that fear together. I I'm that's what I'm feeling listening to your story.

SPEAKER_02 13:05

Yeah, I would, I would agree. It it almost I think God, yeah, I think God wanted me there too to see it.

SPEAKER_03 13:11

I I also th think that maybe it was, you know, you were also there so that you could overcome your own fear, and he knew. And since you both shared the fear, it was like, well, I'm going through this so we can help each other out, but I don't want you to be afraid anymore either, you know. I agree.

SPEAKER_01 13:30

I think that's well said. That's such a beautiful gift. Now, my grandpa, like my sister had this beautiful experience with energy, which I'll tell you, I'm a little bit jealous about, but it wasn't my lesson to learn or my experience to have. But my gramps, he's a trickster, not in the way like we've explained tricksters before, but he's just a jokester. We'll say a jokester because that's funnier than a trickster. A trickster has, I think, malevolent energy. Yeah, a little bit, but he's not. I found out while I was traveling that he had passed. So of course I need to come home. And I had this overwhelming need to get there to write the obituary. Like it was relentless. Like you've got to get there, you've got to write this, you've got to do this. And of course, I get writer's block, but I did feel like the connection with him come through, the connection with my grandma come through, and then it flowed onto the paper. So I'm so grateful for that. But one experience I had with him right after he passed, and this was his way of helping me with one of my fears, and I'm just realizing it right here in this moment, is he passed in Alaska and he was being buried in California next to my grandmother. And I don't know, it really freaked me out thinking of them shipping his body as cargo. And I know this sounds morbid, but it happens, and that was my fear. And I dwelled on it all day, like that whole Friday, I dwelled on it. We went to this big family dinner, and I knew his flight was leaving at like 8:30 in the evening. So it was really breaking me down. I couldn't get my mind off the thought of that. So that night we go upstairs. You know, my husband and I go to bed early, and I was in my closet and I was just looking like at my clothes, just kind of trying to distract myself, and a suitcase fell on my head. And I went out there and looked, and it was the exact same time his flight was supposed to take off. So he helped me face that fear too. Like, it's okay. Like, why are you obsessing about the little things? And I'm like, well, Gramps, I kind of hurt, but at least I'm okay. I'm not suffering from this concussion that you could have given me.

SPEAKER_03 15:43

That's that's actually pretty entertaining. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:46

So I I don't know. I think death is one of those conversations that we need to talk about. It is something that provokes fear apprehension. And I know just hearing my sister's story that has brought me so much comfort in my own views on death.

SPEAKER_03 16:03

Yeah, I I think talking about those tough subjects more too allows us to create, I don't want to say a sense of normal, but it allows us to become more comfortable with that part of life. I know if you're looking at different cultures, we all celebrate it a little bit differently. I believe, you know, here in the US, we mourn death. And it's it's a very sad occurrence typically. But if you go to other cultures, it's a celebration of life instead. It's more it's more upbeat. It's more about what the person overcame or what they did in their life and and who they were. And I know when we talk about funerals here, we essentially celebrate who they they were, but it's not upbeat. It's not usually a party. It's not, you know, everybody's excited to to celebrate this person. It's sadness and loss when, you know, you explore again those other places where it's really celebratory and it's like the next step in in life. And it's pretty cool whenever you can look at the different ways people view it. Right.

SPEAKER_01 17:09

Is he the only one you've been with when he's passed? Have you been in the room with anyone else? No. No. No. Well, the question I'm very curious about have you sensed his energy around you or has he reached out to you through dreams or anything since he's passed?

SPEAKER_02 17:25

I you know, I f I feel him around me all the time. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like when it's kind of my thing. He always liked to go on these drives, and we live in Alaska and we go by Beluga Point, and he'd always want us to drive out there, and we'd sit there and just watch the water and we'd talk, and then I'd drive him back home. But I go we have a cabin on the keenine, so I go there every week during the summer, and I pass that, and he always would stick up his finger and kind of shake it, and that's his way of saying hello. So it's kind of like not the middle finger. No, just his pointer finger. But he would always just kind of shake it and say hello. So, like to me, every time I go by there, that is my my place to visit my grandpa. But I actually feel like he comes with me on the ride every single time, and then I like drop him back off there. I know that sounds weird.

SPEAKER_01 18:20

But that's that's what I do. No, it's kind of like that ritual, you know that you have that place of connection and it brings you right back into that moment.

SPEAKER_02 18:28

Yeah. So I feel like I always pick him up 10 minutes after I start my drive, and he drives the other two hours and 20 minutes with me, and and I take him back. I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 18:39

It's kind of silly, but no, I you know, like Michelle just said, it's it's a very much an energetic connection. And when you have that, it's it's really you you don't just lose it. You don't just let it go. And you know, I know when I've worked with my some of my clients and they're having a hard time, usually I tell them to create a focal point on their drive for an energetic transition of some sort. And you've kind of done that naturally with your connection with your grandfather. And I that's really cool.

SPEAKER_01 19:08

Yeah. So do you think being present with him in that moment when he passed, because I think this is really an important question, it helps you deal with the grief of losing him easier?

SPEAKER_02 19:21

It I would I would say it did. I would honestly, yeah, absolutely it did. I mean, like if you compare him passing I wan I want to say like what Stacy was saying earlier wouldn't when he passed, I didn't and you were talking about like the other cultures and you know how they celebrate their life, this and that. I don't really think that I mourned my grandpa. Like I was happy for him. Like I know, like I know he made it to heaven, and it's heaven, and like in my and what I believe is, you know, this is just our earth shell, our soul lives on forever, and I'm gonna see him again. And he lived to be 87, and we have family, and our family takes care of each other and and they look after us. And they look they look after us and like it's heaven, it's called heaven for a reason, and he made it so it didn't I didn't really mourn I mean I miss him, but then I just go for a drive with him.

SPEAKER_01 20:20

Yeah, so I mean you've had loss since he's passed. Do you think you've mourned others differently because you weren't in that experience?

SPEAKER_02 20:29

Or do you like I I would I don't know, I think since I saw that, I kind of see it a whole different way. You know, of course I miss them and of of course I love them, and I have little things. Like honestly, like every time on this drive, Aunt Pam, you know, that song that she loved always comes on on my drive. I mean, I have now, yeah. I have thousands of songs and I just put it on shuffle, and every time I make that drive, Queen of Hearts. Queen of Hearts comes on. See, I even knew it. And I like crank it, I crank it up. I'm like, okay, Aunt Pam, let's go. You know what I mean? And I have that little bit of memory and that time with her. But out of all the songs that I have on there, it always, it always plays there and it plays back.

SPEAKER_01 21:15

Yeah, that's called Claire Audience. It's a way that you can connect, and I connect through things that way too. So that's a beautiful example.

SPEAKER_03 21:24

And it's just a way for the your, you know, our family to pop up from beyond and just say hello. Like we're here, we're watching your journey too.

SPEAKER_02 21:34

Exactly. No, my grandma was a different, like, I was very, very, very close to my grandma too. And I have different experiences with her, like all the time. Like she's she's there all the time. And she does and it doesn't it doesn't scare me, but she's like she pops up all the time in my life and just does. Didn't you have an experience with a doorbell with

SPEAKER_01 22:00

On the anniversary of her death.

SPEAKER_02 22:02

It was crazy. It was a year of her passing, and a lot of things happened that day. I was watching the prices right. Such a good show. Yeah, I was watching TV. And my dog was laying there, and all of a sudden he like gets up and he's he's on a wood floor and he's trying to run and he can't go fast enough. And finally he runs and he goes upstairs. And I'm like, what the heck? So I like walk upstairs and he's in the he's in the bathroom, like laying on the floor, and I'm like, Briggs, come on, what are you doing? And so like I I grab him and he I pull him downstairs, and our stairs kind of they're kind of like by what's that called? They landing? Yeah, they go down and then there's a landing and they go down again. And so I got him on the landing and I couldn't get him to go all the way down. And I stood there and he like, he like looked at me and then he looked to the side of me, and then he looked at me again and looked to the side, and then he just took upstairs running again. And I'm like and it didn't dawn on me that it was it had been a year since my grandma passed away. And then that night we were having dinner and we have like a ring camera, it's a little bit different, but we're having dinner and the kids were there and stuff, and my doorbell rings, and the kids get up to go get the door, and they're like, Oh, nobody's there. They're like, That's weird. So then they went and they watched the video, and it actually like said the time and stuff that the doorbell rang, but there was nobody there. I just know it was my grandma just saying, Hey, hello, and I'm here for you. I'm here for you.

SPEAKER_01 23:40

I'm watching you.

SPEAKER_02 23:41

But it was it was peaceful, and sometimes I hear her singing. I don't know. I smell her sometimes. And that's weird.

SPEAKER_03 23:49

It it's really not though, because again, it's those are those little nods, like, hey, we're here. I'm we're on this journey with you. And um, do you find that you have a lot of these experiences when you're going through a challenging time too? Where it's almost like a we're here for you. I do. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:07

I do think that.

SPEAKER_01 24:09

So I think it's so cool that again, Gramps chose you to help you face the fear. I know when my grandma passed, uh, the one she was just talking about, we knew the time was coming and we were not with her. She was in California, we were in Alaska.

SPEAKER_02 24:23

I knew she passed that night. Like she came, she came in my dream.

SPEAKER_01 24:27

You knew she was gone.

SPEAKER_02 24:28

Or was I in the dream or was I really awake?

SPEAKER_01 24:32

Yeah. I don't know. You don't know. Um, but anyhow, I was I had a fear too because in life she had been divorced and kind of was on her own. Like she had her kids who loved her, but I was worried that nobody would be in heaven to like greet her or something. I don't know. I was just in my grief in that moment. It was before I opened up spiritual spiritually. I was praying to God. I was praying to my other grandparents who had passed. And I said to them, please, when she arrives, be there to meet her. I just need to know that somebody's there to welcome her. And I felt something squeeze my leg in reassurance. And then I got a call five minutes later from my mom as she passed.

SPEAKER_03 25:14

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 25:15

That is so that was my connective story. Yeah. I didn't see it, but I felt I got that reassurance and that we got this. We're you're okay. She's okay. Yeah. Wow.

unknown 25:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:28

Have you ever had experiences like that with death, Stacey, that have been transforming to you? And where do you stand on death right now? Does it scare you?

SPEAKER_03 25:36

Are you, I mean, not welcoming it for in this moment, but it I'm I for some reason have never really feared death. I and I don't know if if it's just because I'm weird or not, but I think the most interesting, and I don't know if if if it was transformative, but the most interesting experience that I had was when my aunt passed. I went to sleep that night, and I had a stomachache of of sorts, and I just slept so, so, so deeply. And my aunt passed while I was asleep, and I remember waking up being very disoriented and felt something had shift. And my ex came and woke me up and was like, Your mom's been trying to reach you for hours. Hours. My phone had been ringing, it was sitting next to me, and I don't sleep deeply. I think that you and I have talked about that on perhaps in a different episode, but I'm I'm never been a deep sleeper, which means if my phone vibrates next to me, it wakes me up every time. But I slept through it and, you know, I kind of sat with that for a few days because I felt very guilty that she passed and and, you know, I was just asleep. I was very, very, very asleep. But I think the reason that I slept through it was because I was actually a spiritual witness to her her crossing over because she was in in her home by herself and it was very sudden. So, you know, being asleep and that deeply asleep, it allows us to travel farther. And and I can't remember my dreams for that day. I can't remember anything other than the fact that all of a sudden I just didn't feel well and knocked out. So Do you have a good definition for spiritual witnessing? Spiritual witnessing is when a person that is alive is actually there to witness someone crossing over that is perhaps physically alone. Is that a good that's a pretty good definition?

SPEAKER_01 27:30

I think so, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:31

Yeah.

unknown 27:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:32

I know when my aunt passed, couldn't be with her either. But before she passed, I feel like I astral traveled to where she was and we had a whole conversation in which I could tell her to let go of the fear, to go to the light, to not just linger because you're gonna have so much more clarity when you get to the other side. You're gonna be able to watch things and you know the outcome. And I know that helped and that she did cross. And I feel like I got a little bit of confirmation from that from my sister and her daughter because they went into the family home and they're like, we don't feel her here right now.

SPEAKER_02 28:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:11

I remember she showed up then that night in the hotel room.

SPEAKER_02 28:15

Yeah. Yeah. I definitely when I was in her house, there was no energy. Yeah. And you would you would feel it. Just going into yeah, just going into a house.

SPEAKER_01 28:25

Yeah. So well, I know we have lots of talks with my sister, gonna try and bring her up to speed on some of the spiritual stuff and make her a little more comfortable with it. I think you're getting more comfortable. I think you're not as closed off as you used to be.

SPEAKER_02 28:41

I there's just different energy of different levels that scare me. Like the energy with grandpa was peaceful and it was comforting. But then you go other places and you have energy that's just like, okay, my body's telling me to get out of here. Like this this isn't good. This isn't a good space. This isn't a good and I'm like, I need to listen to it.

SPEAKER_01 29:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:03

Like at the penitentiary.

SPEAKER_01 29:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:05

Like that energy was so horrible and so scary. And I remember when we went to London with dad, and I remember it just about everywhere I went there, I had bad energy. Like I just felt bad energy around me, and I was young and it was scary.

SPEAKER_03 29:23

That honestly kind of makes sense. You know, I think Michelle and I have talked about this here because um she wanted to travel to where I live. I live in New Hampshire, and she's like, let's find a cool place to like explore. And I'm like, throw a rock here. Throw a rock. We there's there have been settlements here since the 1600s. It is very much so a different energy when you walk around different spaces. So it sounds like you might have just been in a space that had been so developed over time and for so long that you were just in hundreds of thousands of different energetic worlds kind of transitioning through each other. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 30:02

It may yeah, it makes a lot of sense when you explain it. And I'm just a little bit floored because I was on that trip with her in London and I mean I was open to experiences. I wanted to have them, but I wasn't picking up on that. And this is like the first time I knew or I'm learning that you were picking up on things there. So you've shut it down, like you've kind of tried to push it away a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 30:24

I think I could probably see and feel a lot more than I allow myself to, because it it really does kind of scare me.

SPEAKER_01 30:30

Yeah, and Stacey and I have talked about that too, because she doesn't want to see anything.

SPEAKER_02 30:35

I if if I saw something, it would scare me. And my grandpa used to say that in his house that he lived in that he had seen like my grandma had passed away or whatever, and he had seen a ghost. Remember him always telling that story? So every time I went in his house, I was terrified. I did not want to stay the night there ever.

SPEAKER_03 30:57

It's I experienced the same very similar.

SPEAKER_02 31:00

And I don't know if it was his story. I didn't necessarily have that energy, but if my sister wasn't there, I would not have been sleeping there.

SPEAKER_03 31:07

Yeah. Yeah. No, I I I get that. Seeing, like physically seeing things has always been the one thing that I'm like, I'm good if I never experienced that. Like I see as in feel, I see as in like physically experience, but I would not necessarily want to wake up and see a spirit in in in my bedroom. You know, it would not feel good.

SPEAKER_02 31:28

But I yeah, I I often wonder like, what what is the difference of the bad energy and the good energy? And why do people stay or get caught in the middle? And are they worried about their loved ones and they just can't let go? Is it something like un unfinished business that they think they're going to be able to finish?

SPEAKER_03 31:47

So this is a conversation that I know Michelle and I have had. My my personal theory, and Michelle, you can fill in any blanks, is that people stay because they're they get stuck in a certain energy. So when you're talking about low vibrational spirits and kind of what you've experienced, a lot of that is because when people stay on this plane and don't cross over, they're not raising their vibration high enough to cross over or they're keep keeping themselves in a lower, in a lower vibrational space. So when we deal with stuck spirits, usually they are so stuck on one emotion and it's not a positive one. When we experience spirits that are here that are asking us to go and talk to their daughter because they hurt them, that's not higher vibrational. That's that's human need. And it's if I don't fix this, I can't cross over. It's like, no, if you cross over, you'll actually fix it. Does that make sense? It it does. But I just feel bad.

SPEAKER_02 32:42

Like, why I wish that they could just cross over and have that that joy.

SPEAKER_03 32:47

And and that's one of the reasons why energy. Like, yeah. It's heaven. It's it's heaven for a reason. That's why Michelle and I both do some crossing over work is because we everyone, I I believe it there's no reason to be stuck here unless it's a higher calling. But there are there are spirits that are supposed to be here that choose to stay on a positive in a positive way. Um but the lower vibrational ones I know I tend to cross over.

SPEAKER_01 33:15

Yeah, just stepping into that. Well, thank you for being our first guest. Thank you on our very new and revamped podcast.

SPEAKER_02 33:24

Well, thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_01 33:28

At least in this moment.

SPEAKER_02 33:30

So I like I like listening to it and thank you.

SPEAKER_01 33:36

Thank you. So to our listeners, I'm going to leave you with three closing questions that I'd love for you to reflect on or to reach out to us about. So, question number one, do you think we have any choice or influence over who is with us when we pass? The second question is, have you ever experienced a moment around loss or transition that has changed your understanding of death or dying? And the last question is, what beliefs or experiences help you feel more peaceful about the idea of dying?

SPEAKER_03 34:10

Those are questions.

SPEAKER_01 34:12

Some pretty deep questions. I know I'm gonna sit with them. And I guess with that, do you want to close out the episode, Stacey? Absolutely. Stay curious. Trust what you know, and we'll meet you along the spiritual byeway. Thanks, Christine, and thanks, Stacy. Thank you, Christine.

SPEAKER_03 34:30

Bye, everybody.

SPEAKER_01 34:36

Thank you so much. Spiritual by the show. If you are enjoying the podcast reaching, we preview or to share the show with someone who might need it. Your support helps the podcast reach others who are searching for the same sense of understanding the community. Thank you so much for taking the time to be here with us and walking the stretch of the spiritual five. Wherever you are on your journey right now, just know you're not alone. We're here for you, and we're all in this together.